Vote for the next President of The United States

[CUSP82]

Z the claims hold water. Go do some fact checking.It is indisputable unless you want to call all those folks liars.

Now our medicare system is headed for bankruptcy no to mention a minimum of 60 billion dollars a year in waste and fraud. You mention people not being able to afford their meds and most of them are on medicare and that's just covering the people they cover now. You expand it the way you want and you don't think all hell will break loose? And please don't tell me the the Fed runs thing better than the private sector because you will lose that argument big time.

 

[burtybasset]

Hey just came across this...



Uh oh.

 

[CUSP82]

Hey Burty do you like your universal system over there? Maybe give us some pro's and con's?

 

[burtybasset]

To be fair the NHS is a life saver. However, there are some draw backs...

The standard waiting time in accident and emergency is around 3 hours.

Doctors here are currently striking due to under staffing and them working crazy hours. They say they are a danger to the public because of their current workload. So waiting times are likely longer at present.

Also I saw something the other day where a doctor suggested that immigration is now crippling the NHS.

Despite saving my dad's life, my wife has been referred and messed around with pain and loss of grip she gets in her hands. She caught a train to London where she was referred (costing £70 train journey) only to be told when she got there "they don't do the operation she required". They then booked her in locally the other day for further investigation into her condition for January 2017. This is a very long time, especially when she relies on her hands for her job.

My father in law was recently in hospital due to having a stroke. He had a nurse come and try and force feed him some pills in the night, despite him being unable to swallow and him and other patients having to protest until she went away. She still works at the hospital.

The biggest problem seems to be communication within it and they seem a little absent minded sometimes and a little lazy sometimes. I rarely hear of people suing doctors here like they do in the states and there doesn't seem to be much in the way of punishment if they do something badly wrong, they seem to be just struck off and investigated to see if they can keep their job. Unlike my job where I am put in prison and have to prove my innocence if I don't pay attention (health and safety law).

My father did have some private medical insurance that covered his surgeries when he was transferred to a specialist hospital, but it was NHS doctors who stopped him from bleeding to death when he first arrived at hospital, so I can't give them too much stick.

It definitely could be more efficient. I myself have never experienced private healthcare so I have nothing really to compare it to, so these are just some of my personal experiences with the NHS.

 

[CUSP82]

So you're wife has a hand issue and has to wait until Jan of 2017 to get seen? Americans will not stand for that.

 

[burtybasset]

Yep, she did contact her GP to seek some more meds for the pain she has and he asked about the date she has booked for the hospital. He did say it was too long and he was going to kick some ass for us, but the fact that they think someone could wait that long is a little crazy.

Also forgot to add, my son was successfully delivered at an NHS hospital via C-section and the doctors and nurses their seemed very professional. The doc was an Italian fella who was cracking jokes. Maybe not traditional bedside manner, but it certainly put us at ease.

 

[Rasputine]

In a lot of ways the canadian health care is far better thanthe american system under obamabut now i am off topic

 

[Tamora]

Just to add to Father Burty's post...

The A&E waiting time is targeted at 3 hours and they have "penalties" in the form of fines if these targets aren't met. Obviously, if a patient comes in after a serious trauma etc, they are treated immediately. Others are assessed by triage and placed in a queue according to the seriousness of their injuries, minor cuts, broken toes and whatnot.

Surgery, if required, has to be carried out within 13 weeks from diagnosis and the same rules apply as above, fines for hospitals exceeding that 13 week target and immediate surgery for life threatening conditions.

Many who have private health insurance may well find themselves in a NHS run hospital with a private ward or private rooms being treated by the same doctors and consultants as NHS patients. The last time I was in hospital I spent 6 day on a public ward and I felt sorry for the guys that were in private rooms annexed to the ward...they had bugger all to talk to!

It's just been announced that the NHS has overspent it's latest budget by £2.45 billion. However, it has spent £3.64 billion for the same period on agency and contract staff. That £2.45 billion overspend equates to about £6 million a day, which is chickenfeed compared to the £35 million a day we give to the EU! Leave the EU and support the NHS!

I truly have sympathy for countries whose citizens have to worry about the cost of health care and going bankrupt in the process, families of those that have passed left with huge medical bills. I know that if and when I get ill my care will be totally free at the point of source and be treated with some of the best medical practices in the world.

God save the NHS!

 

[Zman007]

Z the claims hold water. Go do some fact checking.It is indisputable unless you want to call all those folks liars.

Now our medicare system is headed for bankruptcy no to mention a minimum of 60 billion dollars a year in waste and fraud. You mention people not being able to afford their meds and most of them are on medicare and that's just covering the people they cover now. You expand it the way you want and you don't think all hell will break loose? And please don't tell me the the Fed runs thing better than the private sector because you will lose that argument big time.

Here is what Fried, who hired her at Harvard said about the situation. I'll take him at his word unless you are calling him a liar?

The Herald has twice quoted Charles Fried, the head of the Harvard appointing committee that recommended Warren for her position in 1995, saying that the Democratic candidate's heritage didn't come up during the course of her hiring. "It simply played no role in the appointments process," he said. "It was not mentioned and I didn't mention it to the faculty."

The Herald later quoted Fried, a former U.S. Solicitor General under President Ronald Reagan, saying, "I can state categorically that the subject of her Native American ancestry never once was mentioned."

Yes, Medicare in its current incarnation does have quite a few issues, one of which was the removal of the ability of Medicare to negotiate lower drug prices with the pharmaceutical industry. No system, not even the private system can currently handle the unbelievable skyrocketing prescription prices. Since 2011 name brand prescriptions have doubled in price and there is no explanation besides corporate profit. Don't believe me, that was the conclusion of the congressional investigations into the companies singled out for it. Many other countries have functioning universal healthcare systems where they pay much less and get much more for their money. Can you tell me why the US cannot do the same? Are we too incompetent or incapable of administering an efficient system? I would really like to know why the US is incapable of running a Universal Healthcaresystem like the UK's or Switzerland's, or Sweden's, or Germany's, or even Canada's? Why can't we learn from these more successful and efficient systems?

Hey just came across this...

View attachment 83509

Uh oh.

That is not Bernie Sanders. He is one of the poorer Senate Members(82nd) I believe and his and his wife's income last year was only ~$200,000 the vast majority of which was his Senate pay.

To be fair the NHS is a life saver. However, there are some draw backs...

The standard waiting time in accident and emergency is around 3 hours.

Doctors here are currently striking due to under staffing and them working crazy hours. They say they are a danger to the public because of their current workload. So waiting times are likely longer at present.

Also I saw something the other day where a doctor suggested that immigration is now crippling the NHS.

Despite saving my dad's life, my wife has been referred and messed around with pain and loss of grip she gets in her hands. She caught a train to London where she was referred (costing £70 train journey) only to be told when she got there "they don't do the operation she required". They then booked her in locally the other day for further investigation into her condition for January 2017. This is a very long time, especially when she relies on her hands for her job.

My father in law was recently in hospital due to having a stroke. He had a nurse come and try and force feed him some pills in the night, despite him being unable to swallow and him and other patients having to protest until she went away. She still works at the hospital.

The biggest problem seems to be communication within it and they seem a little absent minded sometimes and a little lazy sometimes. I rarely hear of people suing doctors here like they do in the states and there doesn't seem to be much in the way of punishment if they do something badly wrong, they seem to be just struck off and investigated to see if they can keep their job. Unlike my job where I am put in prison and have to prove my innocence if I don't pay attention (health and safety law).

My father did have some private medical insurance that covered his surgeries when he was transferred to a specialist hospital, but it was NHS doctors who stopped him from bleeding to death when he first arrived at hospital, so I can't give them too much stick.

It definitely could be more efficient. I myself have never experienced private healthcare so I have nothing really to compare it to, so these are just some of my personal experiences with the NHS.

Very interesting read, thank you for writing that. The biggest complaint I have seen is the wait times in the UK. Correct me if I'm wrong, but hasn't the wait time problem in the UK only become worse since the conservatives were cutting some of the funding to the NHS? If wait times and overworked doctors are the biggest problem that is directly related to funding. Currently in the US we pay per capita 2.5x what you do in the UK, ($3,400 vs $8,500 respectively). How much of that gap would it really take to alleviate the wait times and overworked doctor concerns in the UK? What is most interesting is in the 2014 report the UK ranks higher than the US for timeliness of care, 3rd vs 5th.

In the US we aren't insuring all of our population and many many Americans are risking bankruptcy ever day as a major illness or accident will result in losing virtually everything you have. Insurance has high deductables and copays that mean massive medical bills with even relatively minor or routine procedures. Something like $600,000 households containing 1.5 million people will file for Bankruptcy due to medical bills and an additional 10 million will acquire medical debt they cannot pay off this year. That is in addition to the most exorbitant health care costs per capita of any country, and paying the most doesn't even come close to offering the best care. From an efficiency standpoint the UK was rated 1st in 2014 and the US was rated 11th out of 11.

 

[CUSP82]

13 weeks to get the surgery you need? Tell that to the Americn who's hip is killing him.

 

[Tamora]

13 weeks to get the surgery you need? Tell that to the Americn who's hip is killing him.

That's maximum times Cusp...many are well within that time. For instance, the current waiting time for the consultant surgeon I'm under is 8 weeks maximum.

If someone gave me the option of pain relief for 8 weeks, or have the op tomorrow and go bankrupt, I know which option I would choose.

The NHS has been around for decades. It works!

 

[CUSP82]

Here is what Fried, who hired her at Harvard said about the situation. I'll take him at his word unless you are calling him a liar?

The Herald has twice quoted Charles Fried, the head of the Harvard appointing committee that recommended Warren for her position in 1995, saying that the Democratic candidate's heritage didn't come up during the course of her hiring. "It simply played no role in the appointments process," he said. "It was not mentioned and I didn't mention it to the faculty."

The Herald later quoted Fried, a former U.S. Solicitor General under President Ronald Reagan, saying, "I can state categorically that the subject of her Native American ancestry never once was mentioned."

night, Professor Warren also claimed that “the people who hired me for my jobs have all made clear they didn’t even know about it until long after I was hired.” In fact, she admitted to the Boston Globe in May that she herself had told both Penn and Harvard she was a woman of color prior to her hiring as a full time professor by Harvard.
In addition, she self identified as a “woman of color” in an article published by the Harvard Women’s Law Journal in 1993, two years before she joined the Harvard Law School faculty as a tenured professor in 1995.


She identified herself as a woman of color in a law review! Do you want me to pull the article? You have one man who said it was not a criteria for her being hired and yet she identifies herself as woman of color numerous times. Come on; she said it herself!

 

[Zman007]

13 weeks to get the surgery you need? Tell that to the Americn who's hip is killing him.

Actually, 13 weeks, or three months is a very common wait time in the US for Hip Replacement. The average wait time in the UK is roughly 2.5 months. Unfortunately there is very little data in the US for average wait times but 1-3 months is common as we don't have mandatory reporting. Also, in the US the better your insurance the faster you are scheduled and moved along making it even more pay to play.

 

[Zman007]

Here is what Fried, who hired her at Harvard said about the situation. I'll take him at his word unless you are calling him a liar?

The Herald has twice quoted Charles Fried, the head of the Harvard appointing committee that recommended Warren for her position in 1995, saying that the Democratic candidate's heritage didn't come up during the course of her hiring. "It simply played no role in the appointments process," he said. "It was not mentioned and I didn't mention it to the faculty."

The Herald later quoted Fried, a former U.S. Solicitor General under President Ronald Reagan, saying, "I can state categorically that the subject of her Native American ancestry never once was mentioned."

night, Professor Warren also claimed that “the people who hired me for my jobs have all made clear they didn’t even know about it until long after I was hired.” In fact, she admitted to the Boston Globe in May that she herself had told both Penn and Harvard she was a woman of color prior to her hiring as a full time professor by Harvard.
In addition, she self identified as a “woman of color” in an article published by the Harvard Women’s Law Journal in 1993, two years before she joined the Harvard Law School faculty as a tenured professor in 1995.


She identified herself as a woman of color in a law review! Do you want me to pull the article? You have one man who said it was not a criteria for her being hired and yet she identifies herself as woman of color numerous times. Come on; she said it herself!

Yes, she was listed as a woman of color in a student-run article in 1993. Found very little mention besides Brietbart and Legal Insurrection on the topic. Did find other mentions from her peers about the topic and no quotes or people involved in her hiring that claim that it was a factor.

Will you please render this level of scrutiny and judgement to Donald Trump? If not, can you please tell me why he gets a pass but a liberal woman does not? I bet we can find quite a bit more damning evidence against Trump than this is against Warren.

 

[AlpineNewt]

That's maximum times Cusp...many are well within that time. For instance, the current waiting time for the consultant surgeon I'm under is 8 weeks maximum.

If someone gave me the option of pain relief for 8 weeks, or have the op tomorrow and go bankrupt, I know which option I would choose.

The NHS has been around for decades. It works!

Well it almost works, it's just a shame the government (both parties) keep messing about with it, I'm sure they do it on purpose so they can privatise it in the future. However, even hardcore Conservatives will riot if they try right now!

 

[Zman007]

Well it almost works, it's just a shame the government (both parties) keep messing about with it, I'm sure they do it on purpose so they can privatise it in the future. However, even hardcore Conservatives will riot if they try right now!

Haha, I find it amazing how even hardcore conservatives in the UK would riot if you took away the NHS, but in the US even the powerful portion of the liberal left, the corporate democrats, won't even embrace it due the money and lobbying done by the pharmaceutical and health insurance industries. And if you try to convince a conservative it is a good idea they like to point to the UK and Canada and tell us how horrible your rationed healthcare is.

It is truly amazing the paradign shift between the US and the rest of the world.

 

[Rasputine]

Why cant we have the health that the politicians have because i know for damn sure none are under obama friggin care

 

[Tamora]

Well it almost works, it's just a shame the government (both parties) keep messing about with it, I'm sure they do it on purpose so they can privatise it in the future. However, even hardcore Conservatives will riot if they try right now!

Agreed...whenever there's a change of Government they cost money and inconvenience by changing stupid things like emails and procedures that don't need fixing. But that's politicians for you.

 

[Tamora]

Talking about pharmaceutical companies, out of curiosity, how much do you guys in the US pay for prescription medicines?

 

[Zman007]

Why cant we have the health that the politicians have because i know for damn sure none are under obama friggin care

Actually, all 13,000 members of Congress and their staffers buy their insurance privately on the exchange. They are part of a Gold level Small Business program on the Washington DC exchange, unfortunately they are currently receiving substantive subsidies for it and the Democrats, not Republicans, who proposed a bill in 2014 to remove that subside and let the well off politicians pay their fair share were defeated by Republicans in the House... well technically it is waiting to be acted upon.