Need some thoughts about Cheating

[Bohning]

Ok let me start off by saying I do not post here a lot but I do read the forums a couple of times a weeks. Most of the time I see some pretty good replies to topics so I thought I would throw one out there.

I am not sure what I am looking for but its something that has being weighing heavy on my heart and mind. Anyway here we go.

I have been married to my wife for 11 years. We have two kids and I truly love my family. We never fight and get along just fine. However she never wants anything to do with me. I am lucky if we have sex once a month. Even asked for it for my birthday two weeks ago when she asked me what I wanted and needless to say all I got was a hat and hoodie. She never has contact with me and often gives me the evil eye if I touch her when she walks by. I find her attractive and will often grab her on the butt as she walks by or something but it drivers her crazy. She won't even sit beside me on the couch to watch TV.

If I go to bed early she stays up half the night to make sure I am a sleep. If I stay up late she runs in and goes to sleep before I can get to the bed. If I am awake and in the bed she will go into one of the kids rooms and tell me she fell asleep in there. Its always something. If I ask her to do out on a date she is always to tired and not up to it but if her parents or one of her buddies or the kids want something she has plenty of energy. She has a very easy job working only 4 days a week and only about 6 hours a day. I work 6 days a week and about 11 hours a day and I can still find time to do things.

Anyway for the past couple of years I have been up and down with this. Sometimes I am angry about it others times upset and sometimes I just laugh about it. She asked me why I was mad one day and I explained to her because she never had any time for me and told her how I felt. She told me she was sorry even cried a little and told me she would try to do better. Well for 3 whole days she did. We did not have sex once in those three days but she did at least sleep in our bed and not the kids and then boom right back to the same old thing again.

Now to the beef of the topic. I have really been thinking about getting the attention I need from someone else. I know once I do I can't take it back. I am not sure how I will feel if I go through with it. However how long is a guy suppose to go without? I feel like she is pushing me further away. I am a Christan man and feel that cheating is wrong but I am going over 5 years of this now. I have talked to her and that has not done any good only gotten worse. I don't want a divorce as with two kids child support would kill me plus I want to be around my kids everyday. However I stay unhappy because I feel like the dog is the only thing in the house that cares if I come home. It would be awful nice to have some attention every now and then.

Oh well thanks for your time in reading my post. I am not sure what I am looking for here. Someone to tell me its ok to cheat or someone to talk me out if it. I have an old high school flame that I am still in touch with and she ask me out about every week and its getting harder and harder to say no.

I look forward to your comments. (I think lol)

 

[CUSP82]

Cheating is wrong plain and simple. Consuling may be a great alternative to work out your issues and come to a resolution one way or another! Besides, guys always get caught!

 

[overunderin]

Err....'Why don't you just force her to have sex? She'd prefer that to cheating' That be Rape...do not even joke about it..

Cheating...not a good idea...

I take it you have talked about it? Just read you have ...keep trying..
Maybe go together to see a councellor ?
A trial separation perhaps, may help her realise what she may be missiing....may push you to divorce though!

Remember everone has differing sex drives, has your wife always been like this?
Has she changed, maybe she is not happy with her body ( No disrespect intended )

Through speaking with many friends, nearly all of them have divorced because of the lack of physical contact after children or after a long time in said relationship..

In my very personal opinion sort the problem do not add another problem to yourself, so do not cheat just try even if it is the last time and then move on with your life, the children will always be yours and you will always see them..

Hope I have helped and again no disrespect was ever intended..

Take Care .

 

[Knuckle Up]

Don't cheat that is just wrong. I would suggest for you to talk to her about the marriage and ask if she has had any thoughts about divorcing because to you it seems like she is totaly dettached from you. Let her know that your unhappy but as her husband you will do anything possible to save the marriage.

 

[dsmall]

I personally would tell her that you need to be intimate regularly and it was what you signed on and agreed to as part of marriage. And that if she no longer had any interest in intimacy with you then you had to choose whether to divorce her or seek intimacy elsewhere. You should explain that the rejection makes you feel less of a man and is emasculating.
Explain that you have options but that you would prefer to have intimacy with her; rather than seek them elsewhere. Explain that she has a choice. That she either works on developing a desire and interest in having intimacy with you; or that you will need to have intimacy with someone other than her; either as an extramarital affair, or as a divorce. Tell her that it has gotten so bad and been so prolonged that you intend to follow up on any opportunity in the very near future. Essentially, explain that this is the last time that you will have this conversation or be forced in a position where you literally have to beg your wife for sex under the threat of infidelity.

 

[dsmall]

Cheating is wrong plain and simple. Consuling may be a great alternative to work out your issues and come to a resolution one way or another! Besides, guys always get caught!

Yeah, well she is being unfaithful to her wedding vows. Marriage is a mutual promise to love honor and cherish each other. She's not doing that. he has already told her that she is not doing that and that he cares and is concerned. Marriage is not a promise to not fuck anybody else regardless of what terrible or thoughtless things you do to me for the rest of my life-- unless they've changed the vows more recently.

A sexless marriage is not a marriage unless both parties agree to those terms. He hasn't. She has unilaterally imposed these terms onto him. That's not a marriage. You can't cheat on someone who has already been unfaithful and checked out of the marriage.

 

[Panther]

First off, no cheating. This is just plain wrong and hurtful. It would hurt her. It would hurt you - guilt. It would hurt the other woman when you left her hanging. Bad idea.

Okay, now for some constructive thoughts.

Find a marriage counselor and, possibly an individual counselor too (for both of you). Although its very difficult and painful, both of you will be better served addressing this head-on. There is a reason she doesn't want sex and she probably doesn't feel safe telling you. Maybe she would feel safe with a MC. If not maybe she would feel safe enough with an IC.

Question for you: has she always been this way? In other words, has she always not liked sex. Do you know if it's painful? Does she still love you? Have you asked that question?

I went through 7 years of bad times with my ex. We didn't have much sex and it was progressively less and less up until the end. I can see how things could've been different if we each addressed our own problems. When you've resolved your own problems its a lot easier to work on your joint problems.

I ended up divorce and have 4 kids. Yup, at first I didn't want to split because I wanted to be with my kids all the time. Child support doesn't bother me...they are mine, I love 'em and will pay for 'em. Strangely, I "see" my kids more now that I'm divorced. For the 1/2 time I have them I come home from work earlier to be with them. When married I would work late.

Hope you can work things out with your wife. I suggesting trying one more time with a counselor. It will be worth it to know you tried your best. Also, seems like the topic of sex will be very important. You may find out some stuff about your wife you didn't know and is very hard for her to talk about. If so, you may need to be even more patient than you already have been.

Feel free to PM me if you want to talk more.

 

[somebodyelse]

I'm not new, but kind of had this happen to me before...

If she's acting weird, first thought of mine is that she's been cheating. Everybody has sexual needs, including women. If her needs are not met and she's in an incredibly agreeable mood everyday, something is up. That said! I wouldn't jump to conclusions and I would talk to her specifically about what's going on and that you are/were, in fact, contemplating an affair because she has not listened to you. Make sure you emphasize the fact that she's not been listening to you and that you're not happy with it and that communication is serious with relationships.

If that doesn't stop her in her tracks, something is wrong with her and you've got more problems than a forum can help you with .

 

[redbear52]

I have known quite a few husbands who have confided to me that their wives lost all or nearly all interest in sex after children, so your problem is certainly not unique.

I suspect that if the status quo continues indefinitely, your marriage will eventually dissolve, so I think you have to accept that as an eventual possibility.

If you do not feel that further discussion with your wife will be helpful, then I think marriage counseling is your only reasonable course of action. Hopefully, a third party will help to open lines of communication between the two of you, and allow you to investigate the possibility of some sort of compromise. If not, then you can tell yourself and your children that you did what you could to keep your marriage together.

If you cheat, and are found out, you will become the "at fault" party in divorce proceedings. I would strongly advise you not to risk that possibility.

I hesitate to mention it, but one of the reasons that a wife becomes cold to her husband is that she is having an affair. Have you considered that possibility? It sounds as if she has rather more free time than you do.

 

[dsmall]

I have known quite a few husbands who have confided to me that their wives lost all or nearly all interest in sex after children, so your problem is certainly not unique.

True. If its just kids. Take it upon yourself to get a sitter and spend some time away from the kids.

I suspect that if the status quo continues indefinitely, your marriage will eventually dissolve, so I think you have to accept that as an eventual possibility.

Very true. You have to accept that you may in fact be heading for a divorce whether you like it or not.

If you do not feel that further discussion with your wife will be helpful, then I think marriage counseling is your only reasonable course of action. Hopefully, a third party will help to open lines of communication between the two of you, and allow you to investigate the possibility of some sort of compromise. If not, then you can tell yourself and your children that you did what you could to keep your marriage together.

I am more skeptical of counseling but it might be good to find out what is really going on. It will keep you from prolonging the inevitable.

If you cheat, and are found out, you will become the "at fault" party in divorce proceedings. I would strongly advise you not to risk that possibility.

New York is really the last "fault" jurisdiction. Almost every where else, fault plays little role in property distribution; alimony, or child support. Again, I view what your wife as doing as being unfaithful to her marriage vows. Your decision to cheat should be based upon whether you can live with the consequences of stepping out and your relationship with your kids, now and into the future.

I hesitate to mention it, but one of the reasons that a wife becomes cold to her husband is that she is having an affair. Have you considered that possibility? It sounds as if she has rather more free time than you do.

This is actually what I thought when I read your story.

 

[phil88]

I personally would tell her that you need to be intimate regularly and it was what you signed on and agreed to as part of marriage. And that if she no longer had any interest in intimacy with you then you had to choose whether to divorce her or seek intimacy elsewhere. You should explain that the rejection makes you feel less of a man and is emasculating.
Explain that you have options but that you would prefer to have intimacy with her; rather than seek them elsewhere. Explain that she has a choice. That she either works on developing a desire and interest in having intimacy with you; or that you will need to have intimacy with someone other than her; either as an extramarital affair, or as a divorce. Tell her that it has gotten so bad and been so prolonged that you intend to follow up on any opportunity in the very near future. Essentially, explain that this is the last time that you will have this conversation or be forced in a position where you literally have to beg your wife for sex under the threat of infidelity.

Definitely this.

Or I think someone said she could be the one cheating. I suspect that too. Either way I still say go with what dsmall said. Sounds like you already live like you are separated, you can continue doing that for the sake of the children and have sex on the side with someone else, if you really do not want to divorce.

 

[Shambok]

I would also recommend giving it one more serious shot at trying to find out what the core problem is that may be affecting her behaviour or attitude to you through counselling and even therapy. Failing that, and as bad as it does sound, I would consider investigating divorce before cheating as sexually frustrating and straining as it is for you now.

It's admittedly hard to give some exact advice on why your wife is behaving the way she is as I think you wish to know on one level. Other commenters here have already supplied potentially valid theories as to why she is behaving so but I'd like to suggest also reading the book 'The Five Love Languages' by Gary Chapman and taking a look through the more obscure book 'If only he knew' by Gary Smalley. There is something feeding her behaviour and both books could potentially give you an indication.

It just struck me how you noted there are never any fights between the two of you. As pleasant as that sounds a lot of the most successful couple relationships I have come across (approaching 5 decades of marriage) have involved a lot of effort between spouses and, indeed, verbal fights at times. The pleasant picture you mention just seems to carry a darker connotation for me as though she's keeping issues that trouble or hurt her bottled up inside and that is feeding ever increasing resentment towards you. There are personality types who don't say what they are feeling or thinking and then one day unexpectedly (to all others) seem to detonate. Again, if that is true for her I would tread carefully, avoid blaming her and maybe leave walking through that minefield for a skilled counsellor as there are a lot of embedded emotional mines here waiting to explode.

The books and advice given here, even applied as best you possibly can, unfortunately won't turn the situation around completely for you without serious counselling but they may just give you insight into her actions and while it may be beyond repair now it could also lead to something more hopeful. To be harsh then she does indeed resent you, although for what I cannot say as you are faithful and do come across as intelligent and considerate. Perhaps you can find out why with those traits.

 

[somebodyelse]

very good advice there too

 

[redbear52]

I suspect that the laws vary state to state, but just because nearly all states have provisions for "no fault" divorce does not mean that your state does not allow a marriage partner to initiate "at fault" proceedings against a spouse if they have grounds for doing so (e.g, marital infidelity).

Furthermore, some states require a lengthy trial separation before granting a "no fault" divorce. It may behoove the OP to look into the pertinent laws in his state.

I agree that Gary Chapman's book is worth the time it takes to read.

 

[dsmall]

I would also recommend giving it one more serious shot at trying to find out what the core problem is that may be affecting her behaviour or attitude to you through counselling and even therapy. Failing that, and as bad as it does sound, I would consider investigating divorce before cheating as sexually frustrating and straining as it is for you now.

It just struck me how you noted there are never any fights between the two of you. As pleasant as that sounds a lot of the most successful couple relationships I have come across (approaching 5 decades of marriage) have involved a lot of effort between spouses and, indeed, verbal fights at times. The pleasant picture you mention just seems to carry a darker connotation for me as though she's keeping issues that trouble or hurt her bottled up inside and that is feeding ever increasing resentment towards you. There are personality types who don't say what they are feeling or thinking and then one day unexpectedly (to all others) seem to detonate. Again, if that is true for her I would tread carefully, avoid blaming her and maybe leave walking through that minefield for a skilled counsellor as there are a lot of embedded emotional mines here waiting to explode.

The books and advice given here, even applied as best you possibly can, unfortunately won't turn the situation around completely for you without serious counselling but they may just give you insight into her actions and while it may be beyond repair now it could also lead to something more hopeful. To be harsh then she does indeed resent you, although for what I cannot say as you are faithful and do come across as intelligent and considerate. Perhaps you can find out why with those traits.

I think that there are a lot of men that view a successful relationship as being one free of conflict. If you grew up in a home with a lot of conflict, you could either follow suit and follow a pattern of a household with lots of conflict; or you could react and avoid it at all cost. Women can view a man that strives to avoid conflict as being uninterested or indifferent to the relationship. And women can change. Initially she could see the lack of conflict as being a relief from a prior relationship or stormy upbringing, but then gradually start to feel contempt over the lack of any substance aside from conflict avoidance. Again, they view it as indifference. Often men who scrupulously avoid direct conflict can be quite passive aggressive in releasing the tension over time.

if there are two people, than some level of conflict is inevitable. How you express disagreement and resolve it is a critical aspect of compatibility. The most obvious issue is that she has been avoiding all physical conflict with you for a very extended period and you have not said to her: WTF?!!! or some more minor and constructive form of the same.

Now you say that you have said WTF to her on multiple occasions and she has not responded. Your only option is to say, WTF, now I'm looking elsewhere; or WTF, we need to see a counselor or I am going to find some loving elsewhere. There are not many more options.

 

[MrBigDick]

OK, don't cheat. That's first and foremost. Cheating is wrong and all levels and you don't want the label as a cheater. Second, living the way you are clearly bothers you otherwise you wouldn't have brought this issue here.

I can't fathom why in hell some men put up with this as long as they do. 5 years bro?? That's WAY too long. You have emotional and physical needs that simply aren't being met and from the sounds of it, it sounds like you may have talked to her about it and she's not taken you seriously by going back to her old habits. In other words, your needs are either unimportant to her (I dated one like this) OR there is something from her upbringing that's holding her back from being a truly good wife.

Have you thought about getting marriage counseling? If not, please consider it. Try everything you can before you call it quits or do the unthinkable and cheat on her. Remember, once you cross that line, you can't go back.

 

[Bohning]

Well it is a concern for me no doubt. Thats why I wanted to know other peoples thoughts on it. To answer a couple of questions.

No it has not always been that way. The first several years she would even start it. Even oral was something back then and that is a big no no now for her.

Yes it did change a lot with kids. After the first it slowed way down then picked up a bit later down the road after the second one it stopped and has not picked back up.

After kids she went from thongs and a belly button ring to granny panties and barely ear rings. Becoming a mother has changed her no doubt. I understand that. I am not expecting her to be a pron star be any means. I would be happy with twice a month at this point once a week would be even better.

No we don't fight at all. I am not trying to brag by any means but I make a pretty good living and we live within our means so everything we have is paid for and we are pretty much debt free. I know money is one of the major causes of fighting in a marriage and thats one thing we don't have to deal with. We really do get along other than I feel left out. Even after talking to her I still don't think she sees a problem. She is 40. She was raised old school and her parents are great. They are a very Christan family and I really don't think she is cheating. I will go ahead and say 99.9% sure she is not but you don't always know.

She is a really good mother to my kids but I think in that process she has become super mom and forgot she is a wife as well.

As well when I mentioned divorce and child support in my first post don't get me wrong I will gladly pay for my children I will give them every dime I have if need be but I have seen so many cases where a judge gives an amount to a woman and she uses it for everything but the kids. My area is known for setting the money issues high and from what I have been told by normal scale to what you make what they would get me for would hurt. It would be hard for me to get a place to stay with the amount I would have to pay.

I would like to say thanks to all of you who have replied. You have given me somethings to think about and most seem to lean towards the way I have been leaning. I feel like its wrong and I don't want to hurt anyone but sometimes its hard. I have a buddy of mine going through the same thing and his wife is friends with my wife go figure but his logic is that it is what it is and he is gonna stay at home because the money would be to high for divorce and just go fill his needs where ever he needs to. I can't say I really fault him because I know where he is coming from. I just don't know if I want to go down that road with him.

 

[MrBigDick]

I don't know where you reside BUT I do work for the local superior court and I do pay child support for my two kids. Child support is based on multiple factors....how much you make, how much she makes (assuming she works). They also take into account health care, percentage of time you have the kids and any mandatory retirement you have to pay into in the overall calculation of child support.

It really boils down to the judge you get in front of. Some are great and some are major pricks with an ax to grind and if they got fucked over in a divorce, they'll see to it that every man pays within the confines of the law. I've seen both men AND women get fucked over in child support (yes, women do get stuck paying it too.........just because she's a mother, doesn't make her the ideal parent to raise the kids).

How old are your kids? Is your wife willing to see a therapist? The way I see it you have two choices her brother. You can keep on keeping on and hope that she somehow changes or you get proactive and go after the happiness that YOU deserve. It's not just all about her and the kids, you're part of the equation and deserve to be happy too. Just because you bring home the bacon is no reason for you to be treated like a stranger in your own home. Have you asked her why she's changed or what happened to the woman you married? I mean to go through that kind of drastic change.....something HAS to be up man.

 

[Bohning]

Well I know child support totally up to the judge but from the checking I have done the estimate I got was from $1200 to $1500 a month plus pay health care and part of the schooling. Kids are in Private School. Again I have no problems taking care of my children but I need to be able to eat as well. She does work and makes about the same amount of money I do. Both of my kids are under the age of 10. We waited later in life to have kids as my wife was in college getting her doctrine degree that took 7 years.

I intend to play this out a little longer hoping to find a fix or at least figure out what needs to be fixed. I wanted to make this post to get some ideas as to what other people thought so maybe it would give me some things to think about or ask and it has. I don't want it to come to a divorce but I am tired of having a need that is not being taken care of. I know cheating is wrong but I see it coming in my near future if I don't figure something out.

Other than sex we get along. I mean she is nice to me as long as I keep my hands off lol. I really just think she has no desire anymore because I feel like if she never has sex again she would be ok with it. On the rare occasion I do get it I feel like I am being done a favor. I think she does stress herself out trying to figure out how many things she can do in a day. I am not sure a lot of it is not coming from her friends. As I mentioned one of her friends is married to my buddy and he is having the same issues and I mean to 100% of what I am talking about. Not really sure how much women talk about this subject with one another but it is strange for us both to be going through it. Oh well if anything happens or I find the answer I will pass it along maybe it will be helpful to someone else one day.

Anyway thanks again for taking time to listen to me ramble on. I am sorry if any part gets hard to read but I have employees walking by looking over my shoulder so I normally close the window and open it back up because they all know my wife and I don't figure they need to be involved in this. So sometimes during that period I loose my thought process.

 

[rimlas]

How often does your wife and your friend's wife hangout? I've seen this before and it turned out that the girls switched sides.