BUT the cost of medical treatment will go WAY down and will cost the insurance companies LESS in the long run sicne they will only insure healthy(or paying) people and the government will get the poor and some of the lower middle class..
Healthcare Bill
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BUT the cost of medical treatment will go WAY down and will cost the insurance companies LESS in the long run sicne they will only insure healthy(or paying) people and the government will get the poor and some of the lower middle class..
Pirate
Retired Administrator, PEGym Hero
My experiences with OSHA, EPA, DOD, IRS, and an assortment of other government agencies keeps me from believing that government control will ever lower costs in the long run.
And who will pay for all these "poor" and sick? I wonder if it will be the American tax-payer...
kingpole
Retired Moderator, PEGym Hero
Ok, this is getting to heated. Lets remain calm. It is not the end of the world. The existing system of halth care that we had was failing. It to a large part is why this nation is in the financial mess it is in. The health care crisis more or less did in the big 3 automakers of this country, GMC, Chrysler And Ford. Not even big instituitons could afford to insure thier workers anymore they had to lay them off.
Private HMO just went up a whopping 39%. Only the riches American can afford health insurance, Co-pays have never been higher and will only get higher. HMO deny more calins than grant them. They have dug thier own grave. Now they can feel free to barry themselves in the pit they dug for others.
Those are the facts, very simple!
For example i could not get health insurance bacause i am diabetic i would be turned down. I would have to wait tell im 65 years old to get any help from medicare for diabetes care supples which into days market would cost about 1200 dollors per month. Insulin alone can run from 60 to 200 bucks for a 30 day supply. Fortunately i control the diabetes with diet.
The special glasses alone cost 300 dollors, my 23 eye surgeries came to about 50K. The keflex bullshit Tacked on another 15K.
Private HMO just went up a whopping 39%. Only the riches American can afford health insurance, Co-pays have never been higher and will only get higher. HMO deny more calins than grant them. They have dug thier own grave. Now they can feel free to barry themselves in the pit they dug for others.
Those are the facts, very simple!
For example i could not get health insurance bacause i am diabetic i would be turned down. I would have to wait tell im 65 years old to get any help from medicare for diabetes care supples which into days market would cost about 1200 dollors per month. Insulin alone can run from 60 to 200 bucks for a 30 day supply. Fortunately i control the diabetes with diet.
The special glasses alone cost 300 dollors, my 23 eye surgeries came to about 50K. The keflex bullshit Tacked on another 15K.
i dont have health insurance, but i care for my body to well to even need a proper doctor visit, one of my gym buddies is in medical school and he helps the whole gym out..
kingpole
Retired Moderator, PEGym Hero
23 eye surgeries...holy sh*t!
I feel your pain (says this in bill clinton-esque voice). So the area of reform you would be most interested in would be provisions that make it illegal for an insurance company to discriminate on the basis of pre-existing conditions. This is a valid concern. But it does not mean we need a government take-over of health care.
I feel your pain (says this in bill clinton-esque voice). So the area of reform you would be most interested in would be provisions that make it illegal for an insurance company to discriminate on the basis of pre-existing conditions. This is a valid concern. But it does not mean we need a government take-over of health care.
kingpole
Retired Moderator, PEGym Hero
We forget one thing in this country in that it is different from others. This is a country where the citzenry is the goverment. We seem to have lost that idea." For the people by the people" The fear tactics the Republicans are using to squash any kind of reform has almost worked. Keep in mind that party is in the pockets of the HMO's.
I also disagree that a instituiton should make a profit off of the misfortunes of sick people.
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Uh guys as an Australian this is none of my business, but can I ask a question.
Most developed countries already have health care. In fact it is often seen as a sign of a developed country.
The U.S. is a rich country, is money really the issue, or is it something else?
Most developed countries already have health care. In fact it is often seen as a sign of a developed country.
The U.S. is a rich country, is money really the issue, or is it something else?
The bill is a peice of Soviet sh*t. Obama was bad but this has crossed the line. our children and grandchildren will pay for the trillions in debt it will inccur, aswell as maybe having to wait months, years, or possibly going to another country for medical treatment ( apparently when the Vice Premier of Canada came to the USA for treatment we didnt get the memo that nationalized healthcare is for lazy fucks).
Pirate
Retired Administrator, PEGym Hero
I believe that you are correct, Pegasus, and money is not the issue.
Personally, I believe that government should be involved in as little of my life as possible. Some aspects of government control are unavoidable (national defence, currency control, for example) but unless there is a demonstrable overwhelming need, then I think that there are beter ways to handle things. Furthermore, if government must be involved, then try the lowest level first and work your way up. Never start at the national level. We are far too diverse a nation to be treated this way.
Them's my thoughts, anywho.
I agree that the state of health care in this country needs some work. However the government should not be running it thats for sure. I don't understand why Health insurance is run more like auto insurance? Make it illegale for anyone not to be insured plus make it illegale for the Insurance companies to not insure someone. Now I also would support a scale on payment based on your choosen lifestyle. Ie. if you are a smoker or obese or a drug user you should have to pay more. Any conditions that are a result of actions not of your making should have no effect on you ability to have lower payments.
Money is an issue. Money has always been an issue for this country. Why? Because we spend money that we don't have. The problem I have with this healthcare bill is NOT that I don't believe everyone deserves health coverage. No, not that at all. It's the fact that our government has no logical method for paying for it. I don't care what people say about this program not costing the taxpayer a dime. That's bullshit and you know it. A change of this magnitude is going to have costs, and our government has shown in the past time and time again it is all too willing to reach into our pockets to pay for these costs. You're going to get national healthcare but you probably won't be able to afford the gas that it will take to drive to the doctor's office.
I have been married for 4 years. My wife and I looked into insurance when we were first married. They wanted $250 per month for the both of us. So at $250 per month and it has been 4 years that means we would have paid out $12,000!!! That is a lot of money to poor college students. I had knee surgery the other day. No insurance paid it all out of my own pocket... Total cost to me $4,000 would have been $7,000 if I had insurance... If I am now required to buy health insurance my same knee surgery would have cost me the $12,000 plus 20% of $7,000 or $1,400. Total cost $13,400 My cost $4,000 Savings of $9,600. I think I am better off my way... How dare someone tell me what is best for me.
My 2 Cents
My 2 Cents
So Fish, you're saying that not buying insurance was beneficial to you? Thats pretty interesting. Well, under Obama care it will soon become illegal for you to do that. How dare you manage your own money!
PEskeptic - I go insane every time I think about this... Poll after Poll has shown the MAJORITY do not want this, yet it is crammed down our throat. Hell if I am now required to pay for this can I get 80% back of what I paid???
Gator - I love that sig, my dad use to tell me that all the time when I was younger before he passed away.
Gator - I love that sig, my dad use to tell me that all the time when I was younger before he passed away.
Good post Gator. The Obamascam Healthcare Deform isn't about giving access to good health care, it is about funding medical coverage for 12 million criminal aliens, it is about repaying Obama's thug buddies in the unions for their support. What you have seen here is Chicago Gangster Style Politics, i.e. influence peddling, bribery, and when those didn't work outright threats. The worst insurance policy in the world only goes to 70 pages, here is 4000 pages, and know one really knows what is in the plan for sure.
The whole debate has been totally without merit. They keep speaking of reforming Health Care. There is nothing wrong with healhcare in the US of A that needs reforming. We have the finest drugs, doctors and hospitals in the world. You don't see Texans swimming the Rio Grande to get health care in Mexico do you? You see Canadians streaming into Buffalo, Clayton, and Plattsburgh NY to escape their restrictive system. The waiting time for angioplasty in Canada is 6 months, here it is currently about 6 hours. Every mandate that comes down increases the cost of insurance, HIPAA and its son in law that was hidden in the TARP bill raised your cost without any benefits. Insurance costs are merely a reflection of what the doctors and hospitals charge. Medicine is the same. Most insurance companies are under restrictive state control about profit margins. Some as low as 10 over claim. Look at the failure of the Mass., plan which is eating that state's budget in a place already taxed beyond reasons.
We already have the beginnings of a doctor shortage, recall that ol Slick Willie cut funding for medical education. Older Doctors are going to retire early rather than take directions from some GS3 Clerk in DC. Medicare funding has will be cut by another 500 billion. Maybe this plan should be know as the screw your grandparents plan.
All in all it goes back to GIGO. Not familiar it is Garbage In, Garbage Out.
frb3 - its people like you that allow me to keep my sanity.
The greatest thing is when Pelosi and co. say "We join those politicians before us who created medicaid and social security with this great social program." Yeah....anybody checked on the status of social security and medicaid lately? I hope they're not bankrupt...
The greatest thing is when Pelosi and co. say "We join those politicians before us who created medicaid and social security with this great social program." Yeah....anybody checked on the status of social security and medicaid lately? I hope they're not bankrupt...
kingpole
Retired Moderator, PEGym Hero
Americans feel they are giving up thier rights by this bill passing. We have mandatory auto insurance in most states of the union. I do not see how paying something for health care coverage would be any different.
The next job on the list is to cut the cost of medicine which is rediculous. A bottle of Statins is about 160$ and climbing. You can get the same medication in Mexico for about 10$.
kingpole
Retired Moderator, PEGym Hero
