A year of learning about myself

[notsobad2]

Hello everyone. This will be my "diary", I hope. Feel free if you think you can help me find my path to the holy grail

I found the thread PreE90 about a year ago and even started it. I bought a fleshlight as I don't have a chance to practice on any girl currently. Started reverse kegels, sitting on a ball, stretching, meditation (this was especially needed as I had not much to do during winter and my brain went nuts about all the wrong things). Then... I dropped the whole program and just tried to masturbate without going straight to the point.
Later I bought an anaesthetic in spray (lidocaine), to give it a try. I used more than the dosage, like twice, and it somehow helped. I felt numb for some time but soon I felt the orgasm coming, guess what was next...
Condoms don't work either.
I know that my frenulum is pretty sensitive and it kinda desensitized after that year of conscious masturbation.

The most important thing I found during my journey is that I can keep on pumping when my mind is distracted. I started doing duolingo and then thought that I might also try to distract myself with that (once, when my ex was going down on me I stopped thinking about anything, I didn't feel any significant sensation, I was just drifting in my "nothing box" and stayed without orgasm till she told me her jaw hurts and I should orgasm already ). The duolingo was a hit. Basically I just could go with the fleshlight for the entire exercise, slow down a little before starting a next one and so on.
Today I tried to masturbate with fleshlight at home office and it worked to (programming, so it takes some brainpower). Unfortunately "thinking about baseball" doesn't really work, at least now.

As for the brain chemistry, for the last year I tried to stay positive, I found myself quite a lot of projects and right now, during winter, I can't complain about a lack of activities. I try to sleep for at least 6 hours, on weekends I can sleep for 12 or more
This year I will try to cycle more, maybe I will start next week. I know it gives me a testosterone and dopamine boost, especially when it's cold and there is snow around (I hate winter, so a little contradiction ).

I think that's all for my reasearch at my own pace. It looks like I should concentrate on training my mind, the body is not that significant. The thing is I don't really know how to do this (OK, I found ByggD's guide, but I'm not sure if it is what I am looking for).

 

[notsobad2]

A little update.
I am about 1,5 weeks into ByggD's guide and I can confirm that distracting myself helps a lot. Without much effort I can think about any event from the past or my plans for future. A few times I got so far into distractions that I felt I got a little soft. If I catch myself thinking "oh, so much time has passed, I'm probably like 5-10 minutes into the routine", I get aroused and I have to stop.
The first round I can go for about 3-8 minutes (with distracting myself), depends on a day. Then I try to follow the guide, lower the arousal, resume the exercise. With each round the time between rests shrinks. After about 20 minutes I can't do much, even after going down to "7" with a few movements I will go to 9. This looks like a threshold.
The thing is I don't want to stay disconnected from everything around me, I want to be in the place with my body and my mind. I think this will be hard for me. I feel like I should stay in week 1 routine and connect both of my heads together.

 

[Git Tom]

Hey boss, I’ve gone through a bit of a similar process as you when I started my PreE journey and since then my views of it have changed drastically. I think what you have to say about working on your mind more then your body is valid and I’ve found many instances where when I was in the right mind space I was able to last longer with the girlfriend then usual.

However one thing I have to ask you though is do you feel any pleasure during your masturbation? Or during the time your ex gave you head and you were in your “nothing box”. Because I noticed whenever I’ve been in the same mind space as you as in like “oh let’s not think about how arousing it is or anything let’s just try and distract ourselves” I’ve always found to experience 0 pleasure. Like I remember back when I’d jerk off for 20 minutes and not feel any good feelings whatsoever or even have sex with no pleasure, so I’m curious if it’s just me or if you too experience the same? I’m just curious cause I can last a while but as soon as I feel any pleasure I cum within the next 10 seconds.

If it’s just me then I’m glad to hear your progress man and I wish the best to you, but if you experience the same as I do let me know man it’d be helpful to me and I might also have some further input then that could be helpful to you too.

 

[notsobad2]

Indeed, I feel exactly the same. It's more like stroking an arm rather than a place full of nerves. Then with just a slight thought in a good moment, an excitation builds really quickly. Sometimes I am able to distract myself back, but if not it goes boom.
I used to watch porn and masturbate, but without much thinking of that I could sit there for an hour or two (manual mode, not a fleshlight). It's like a switch, no fun/full throttle. I would like to do something about it, but for now I have no idea what to do. I'm about two weeks into ByggD's guide, I think I know some more about how it works, but not much more about pree. I can still end the session within 1-2 minutes if I think in the right direction.
Lately I was thinking about talking to a doctor or getting a prescription to test out some clues (mostly SSRI's or something).

I am happy to hear I am not alone and there is somebody with the same case. I mean in a good way
I would love to hear whatever you can share. Fingers crossed for your journey too.

 

[Git Tom]

P.S. This shits long as fuck but hopefully you'll be able to learn something from it that'll help.

Sorry for the delayed response I've been a bit busy but I can tell you from personal experience that an SSRI will help 0%. If you experience the same thing that I do when it comes to masturbation as stroking an arm, if you go on an SSRI it'll be the same thing, the only difference will be you won't be able to cum (or at least that was for me), so I'd personally advise against it but you can still try it if you want to, I'd just recommend to try it a lower dose first (I used paroxetine and lemme tell you at 20mg, you lose your erection before you can cum, and no pleasure at all).

But that aside, I see you've been going through ByggD's guide, but have you looked at this pinned post plateau edging? I think when it comes to PreE, or at least our type of PreE the root cause behind it and the way to cure it is learning to control pleasure, because for us either we have no pleasure and don't cum or as soon as we get any pleasure we cum (just like the no fun or full throttle thing you talked about).

I think learning your arousal is extremely helpful, I also think things like RKs, IKs, stretching and developing a relaxed pelvic floor, breathing, and ballooning/desensitization are all extremely important but these are not the root cause nor do they cure our issue. After all, if that were the case that would mean that every guy who doesn't have PreE just has perfect arousal control while watching the same porn as us, has a relaxed and stretched pelvic floor even though most of them don't even know what a RK is, and just know to always take nice big deep breaths in order to stay relaxed while having sex, which I doubt is the case. Additionally, studies have even shown that guys who incorporate a kegal routine end up lasting longer than guys who don't which is completely contradictory to having a relaxed pelvic floor and doing RKs.

So, from my personal experience what I've found to actually be the root cause (or at least for myself) has to do with the behavioural side of PreE and plateau edging. To give a quick rundown of what plateau edging is (it talked about in the post I linked earlier), it's basically slowly masturbating until you find a point where it's pleasurable but you're still in control and aren't hitting PONR. From here you just masturbate in this so-called plateau slowly retraining yourself from the behavioural side that this is what sex is supposed to be like, in other words learning to control your pleasure and disassociating pleasure from ejaculation (so basically understanding that you can have pleasure and not ejaculate). The premise to say behind plateau edging is that for use PreE'ers, as soon as we feel pleasure we shoot up to ejaculation and then that's it, but for the normal person, when they feel pleasure it shoots up but then it hits a plateau where they are able to feel pleasure for extended periods of time without ejaculating. The linked post has a nice graph that details it and explains it better.

But basically, once I started to incorporate this I've found myself slowly making "real" progress as in I can actually feel pleasure for longer and longer. Additionally, some things I want to say about this is when you do (if you do choose to) start to edging like this, something I feel that is important is saying fuck time, it doesn't matter how long you last and to really just focus on the pleasure and having a good time. Still incorporate breathing, relaxation, RKs, and everything as you've learned since they do help, but don't focus on performance at all until you've developed a margin as I call it, till where you can last a few minutes with real pleasure, from there then focus on time and lasting longer. I say this because I've personally found that times when I just say fuck it and just try and have a good time masturbating is when I last the longest and have the best experience. I've also read many posts where people said that as soon as they said fuck it that they don't care about performing or focusing on pleasuring the girl they're with, they've found that they slowly started to last longer and longer.

Just as a tip, if you ever find it hard to find pleasure like this somethings that helped me are as follows: I've always found a Fleshlight to be pleasurable regardless of how aroused I am (that's another thing I think arousal and pleasure are pretty closely tied), I've found that masturbating to light arousal (I use pictures sometimes) helps me generate pleasure while not being to overly aroused like I do get from videos or audio, and finally I've found after a long day or even just at night right after the gym where I'm exhausted and like really relaxed that it's easy to find pleasure (I guess it just has to do with the being in the right mindset of actually wanting to masturbate and feel pleasure and not just doing it in order to train to last longer).

Another thing to note, as I discussed earlier I think the root cause lies in the behavioural side of PreE, so I think it's important to completely retrain ourselves when it comes to how we view and go about sex, that's why I recommend ignoring how long you last and just focus on having a good time. Additionally, as PreE'ers everything we do is fast, get hard fast, jerk off fast, cum fast, clean up fast, and this ties in with the behaviour of how we see sex & masturbation. I remember reading a post where a guy said that before he even starts masturbating he gets hard and just sits there with an erection for 5 minutes in order to teach himself to take things slow. I kinda relate to this because just recently when I had sex I let my girlfriend jerk me off while we were kissing (something I normally don't do because I wanna save all the juice for the actual sex) and I found that not only did it feel really good but when we went to actually have sex I lasted longer than usual.

Ultimately, I feel the root cause of my PreE and maybe yours lies in the behavioural side (so edging and how we go about masturbation and sex) of it and is influenced by the psychological side (so our anxiety, stress, and worries about lasting long and doing it). I personally think the behavioural side is really all of it, but it can get overshadowed by the psychological side. However, I think the psychological side is also rather minimal since once you start to see progress from your edging sessions it'll fill you with confidence. Also, I read a post where some guy after edging for like 7 months went to finally have sex he was super anxious and stressed about it but ended up lasting long regardless. Personally, I don't think the physical side (our pelvic floor) has to really do with anything regarding actually curing PreE, but has to do with once it's been cured how to step it up and last longer and longer.

These are my personal findings about my PreE so idk if it applies to everyone maybe not even you. After all, some guy literally posted recently that he fixed his PreE by literally just fixing his anterior pelvic tilt, so idk I guess everyone is different.

Once again these are my personal findings and it's very well some mod might come in here and just sh*t on it but I hope you might have learned something from it that'll help you in your journey. If you ever wanna discuss anything further with me you can always just drop a reply on this post and I'll get back to you, but till then best of luck pal.

 

[notsobad2]

Your post indeed is a long one, but with that you show me a great and reasonable sounding solution. Thank you for that, even if it won't work
Actually I was kinda walking around it, but in terms of regular life. I try to learn and use the knowledge that the trip, not the destination, is the part where I should find all the good feelings and stuff. I have to admit now, that if my PreE root cause is an inability to control pleasure then it is caused by about 20 years of (now I know that) poor masturbation routine.
I hope in my next post I will confirm everything here, but I have to try to control the self-pressure

 

[notsobad2]

It's been more than a year and I'm in almost the same place as I was.
I was inconsistent in changing my habits and kegel training.
I know that my problem comes from my brain and many years of poor masturbation habits during teenage years. Even using a lot of lidocaine (makes skin numb) spray does almost nothing, I feel the pleasure coming from the very center of the penis.
Not thinking about pleasure/sex is making me stay longer, but I don't want to keep myself distracted with a girl by a language course :/
Right now I go to psychoterapist because I used izotek (isotretinoin) for acne but it gave me a lot of physical and mental pain, including depression. I wanted my PreE problem to stay hidden, but I think I won't be able to fix my head all by myself. Also I pay for all the visits, so why not to try a professional help. I am there because I am unable to find a girl and PreE is a part of that problem.

 

[mistergeorge]

It's been more than a year and I'm in almost the same place as I was.
I was inconsistent in changing my habits and kegel training.
I know that my problem comes from my brain and many years of poor masturbation habits during teenage years.

Premature ejaculation is not caused by poor masturbation habits during teenage years. If that were true, then most of us would have the same problem.

I see guys with a variety of problems (not just PreE) get on here all the time and blame themselves for masturbating too much or masturbating in the wrong way. And there's a lot of anti-masturbation propaganda on the Internet coming from various subcultural fads to reinforce this thinking.

Premature ejaculation (or rapid ejaculation as it is better termed) can have complex and mysterious causes. It's not always so easily solved. If you are still young and have little real sexual experience, it is more common. Be persistent and be patient with yourself.

Whatever the exact cause of your PreE problems, I commend your decision to try talking to a therapist. That's a courageous decision. Most guys tend to resist the idea, but talk therapy can be helpful on many levels. You are describing significant distress over this problem and therapy could help you begin to sort it all out and find other solutions. You might even discover other root issues you will want to work on. Give it time. Give the therapist a chance to get to know you. If you decide you don't like the therapist try another one. Stay with it, and best of health to you.

Even using a lot of lidocaine (makes skin numb) spray does almost nothing, I feel the pleasure coming from the very center of the penis.
Not thinking about pleasure/sex is making me stay longer, but I don't want to keep myself distracted with a girl by a language course :/
Right now I go to psychoterapist because I used izotek (isotretinoin) for acne but it gave me a lot of physical and mental pain, including depression. I wanted my PreE problem to stay hidden, but I think I won't be able to fix my head all by myself. Also I pay for all the visits, so why not to try a professional help. I am there because I am unable to find a girl and PreE is a part of that problem.

 

[notsobad2]

By poor masturbation habits I mean trying to get to orgasm as fast as possible. It continued for many years and I finally found out that it's not healthy like two years ago. I had no problem with that as I was single for most of my adult life. My first and only relationship was bad on many levels. This is just what I found and that can be one cause but I am aware that there could be plenty of them. I'm 33 right now, so it is about time to stop being anxious about PreE. Especially that it also holds me from finding a girl.
Never heard about anti-masturbation propaganda. I only know about NNN but I think about it more like a willpower training. Never participated in it tho.

I made the decision yesterday and I will talk with my therapist. I don't have any significant chance to sorting it out by myself.

 

[mistergeorge]

By poor masturbation habits I mean trying to get to orgasm as fast as possible. It continued for many years and I finally found out that it's not healthy like two years ago. I had no problem with that as I was single for most of my adult life. My first and only relationship was bad on many levels. This is just what I found and that can be one cause but I am aware that there could be plenty of them. I'm 33 right now, so it is about time to stop being anxious about PreE. Especially that it also holds me from finding a girl.
Never heard about anti-masturbation propaganda. I only know about NNN but I think about it more like a willpower training. Never participated in it tho.

I made the decision yesterday and I will talk with my therapist. I don't have any significant chance to sorting it out by myself.

Thanks for the clarification. I hear you. I believe you've made a very good decision for yourself after doing the best you could on your own. Best of luck with the therapy path.

 

[notsobad2]

Thank you.
I hope this will work. If not, the only solution is to reconcile and live with it. Hopefully with an understanding woman.

 

[Jacky_1]

I don't know man, with the amount of people struggling with PreE and seemingly running in circles in terms of progress, I'm starting to think this sh*t is incurable. I hope I'm wrong, but all I see in these "training log" threads is people blaming themselves despite putting so much effort into their training. Yet, reconciling with it is a painful thought. I truly wish it works for you, and perhaps then pessimistic folks like me can start believing again .

 

[Johnny D]

Except that there are many success stories around here, so.... ya...it's curable. You're not really posting about the work you're doing to address it, though.

 

[Jacky_1]

I am not posting it because I have not found success with it, not because I ain't doing it. Work includes reverse kegels, pelvic floor relaxation exercises, lots of exercising (especially ab and glute/hip work to avoid APT), edging using the arousal ladder, and ballooning. One and a half year later, I'm pretty much where I started. Perhaps it's curable for some and not others, I don't know. I won't stop trying, but there is definitely a suspicion creeping inside me that all this might be futile.

 

[mistergeorge]

...Perhaps it's curable for some and not others........

That seems to be the medical consensus. There's still a lot that is not understood about the male reproductive system.

Might want to read this article which discusses the history of medical literature on pre-E and several different types of pre-E. Some types of pre-E are obviously more likely to be successfully treated than others:

The pathophysiology of lifelong premature ejaculation - PMC

For many decades it has been thought that lifelong premature ejaculation (PE) is only characterized by persistent early ejaculations. Despite enormous progress of in vivo animal research, and neurobiological, genetic and pharmacological research in ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Pegasus]

If you have a progress thread I will look at it . Otherwise it's very hard to know what was done .

 

[notsobad2]

@Jacky_1 @mistergeorge
I think I found the source and explanation of my PreE. I use a fleshlight, so I can't really control any grip or stuff like that. So the "measurements" I take can be comparable.
My therapist said I am detached from my emotions. I knew that, but I was not fully aware of what it is. So, for a try I started masturbating and... I was able to go for like 5-6 minutes without any feeling of incoming orgasm. At 10 minutes with the same pace I orgasmed.
What I did is I let go of the need to not orgasm early, but I also didn't use porn, plus I kinda distracted myself. Not perfect, not terrible, as I can get the power over PreE and gain some confidence with it. I still have to get connected to my emotions, imagination and ofcourse the real thing (if I find anyone), but this is a step forward.

 

[notsobad2]

I am not only detached from my emotions, but also I am constantly stressed. Since childhood, really. I didn't know that for real, because for me it was "normal". I knew that from time to time I get really stressed, but I thought that I was keeping myself calm and I have control over myself. That control and it's source is the reason for stress.
I did only one test, but I got 544 cortisol, where the upper limit is 500. If this is constant, then I have a hard time all the time. This and the previous reasons and guess why I have PreE

 

[Big Al]

I am not only detached from my emotions, but also I am constantly stressed. Since childhood, really. I didn't know that for real, because for me it was "normal". I knew that from time to time I get really stressed, but I thought that I was keeping myself calm and I have control over myself. That control and it's source is the reason for stress.
I did only one test, but I got 544 cortisol, where the upper limit is 500. If this is constant, then I have a hard time all the time. This and the previous reasons and guess why I have PreE

Do you engage in regular meditation or participate in Emotional Visualization exercises to help manage your stress?

 

[notsobad2]

No, I don't. I am not sure if meditation works for me. It kinda does probably, but the stress comes from the childhood and schemes I created to "survive".
As for the emotional visualisation, I just heard about it. I know I can bring some memories and some emotions attached to it. The emotions are even more vivid than the pictures. From time to time I get a flash of such memories and after processing what I remember and what I feel, I feed my self confidence with it. Because most of them are positive, but I ended up burying them, as feeling any proud of myself was programmed as "wrong".
I am currently on a therapy for 6 months and we have many subjects open. I can already feel and see changes the therapy gave me, but most importantly, how isotretinoin gave me the last and most powerful kick in my mental (and physical) butt. After just 4 months of taking the smallest dose I had most of side effects, lost 8 kg, lost self confidence, lost strength and gained depression, mental & physical fatigue, tics, back pain and so on.

However, I am on the brighter side now, off isotretinoit for good, 8 months now. I know I have to and I want to change my life approach and schemes. If it cures my PreE - great. If not - I will try to find another way. The road I had to take to being here was rough, but here I am.